Bourland in North Texas and Indian Territory During the Civil War: Fort Cobb, Fort Arbuckle & the Wichita Mountains

by Patricia Adkins-Rochette

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Blair DNA Project correspondence

 

My direct ancestor is Francis Harvey  Blair (1832-1883)

 

 Debbie Blair Owen Compilation of Blair research        http://www.silverhillala.com/blair/

 

our Blairs belong to DNA Group 4     http://blairdna.com/group04.html

 

John A. Blair       j_blair@blairdna.com

Goffstown NH
BLAIR DNA Project Administrator,  
BlairDNA@blairgenealogy.com

 

 

Francis Harvey  Blair's ancestors

Francis Harvey Blair, Frank Blair, b. June 19, 1832 in Missouri to Sarah ( ? Gray, Grey) and William Blair [d-bet 1840-1850 Lawrence Co AR], probably son of John Blair [d-1808 Cape Girardeau, MO], son of immigrant Thomas Blair.  (1728-1796).   .....  Frank Blair had 3 granddaughters with "Grey, Gray" as a middle name.  He was a saddler, gunsmith, wagonwright, and a carpenter. He built the first business building in Mineral Wells, Palo Pinto Co., TX plus he owned a saddleshop next door to the courthouse.  Frank died Nov 22, 1883 in Mineral Wells, TX, Beetham Funeral. Home.   

correspondence

Sandi Vaught , Mon, Aug 31, 2009 10:51 AM <<vaught2@cableone.net>> I'm happy to hear you've found someone from your branch of the family willing to participate. The next step is for Jerry Blair to fill out the application form on the Blair DNA web site  >>http://blairdna.com/application.html<<.

         I'd strongly recommend having at least the 37-marker Y-DNA test done. The 67-marker test would also be fine, but that test is much more expensive, and the comparison pool for other Blairs is currently small. On the other hand, 25 or fewer markers wouldn't provide a sufficient basis for comparison, since some of the differences among the Blair descendants currently listed in Group 4 appear in the markers between #25 and #37. Unfortunately, there's a bit of a discrepancy on the application form about the cost of the test, so Jerry Blair will need to resolve that before he can apply. The drop-down box on the form says $149, but the check box on the list of agreements below this says $189. To add to the confusion, the Family Tree DNA web site (the company through which the Blair DNA Projects participants are tested) says that the 37-marker test costs $169. I'd suggest e-mailing the Blair DNA project coordinator for clarification of the current prices.

          If my hypothesis is correct, and your side of the family is dscended from emigrant ancestor Thomas Blair (Ancestor #0029) and his son John, then Jerry Blair's results should be identical or nearly identical to those of Participant Anc04, the hypothetical common ancestor to the Group 4 Blairs, since the results of Thomas Blair (#0029) and Participant Anc04 are identical at the 37-marker level. As for your question about the relationship between Ancestors #0110 and #0017, I'm afraid I don't have an answer. The likely father of #0110 was named Hiram Blair, which would at least suggest a connection with William Hiram Blair (#0017), but I don't have enough information about these families to say how likely it is that one is descended from the other. -Richard Carlson <<richard-j-carlson@uiowa.edu> >

 from Richard Carlson 

 

Fri, Sep 19, 2008 01:56 AM  ....  Hi All     Iíve been in contact with Debbie Blair Owen, daughter of Harvey Lenard Blair, whoís a 37-for-37 match with Harold and Rick.  (I wonder who the other 5 matches on Family Tree DNA are?)  It looks like we really may be onto something here.  Between the DNA evidence and documentary evidence generously supplied by Debbie and by many of you, Iíve formed a hypothesis that we can test against written records, where possible.

 Debbie has traced her line back to Thomas Blair (ca. 1729-1796), who emigrated from Ireland to South Carolina in 1767.  Debbie is descended from Thomasís oldest son James, who was born ca. 1758 in Ireland.  Thomasís 1795 will lists several children, including sons Thomas and John.  They were not listed as part of Thomas (Sr.)ís family in the 1767 emigration record, so both sons were probably born in South Carolina in the 10 or 15 years following 1767 (probably not later, since Thomasís wife Margaret was already 33 when she emigrated).  This is consistent with the birth dates in the 1770s estimated for the ancestors of some of us here, Thomas Blair (died 1839) and John Blair (died 1808) who died in Cape Girardeau Co., MO.

Nothing more seems to be known about two sons Thomas and John of the immigrant Thomas Blair.  In particular, they do not appear in the 1800 or later census records of Chester County, SC, where the immigrant Thomas Blair died in 1796.  Again, this is consistent with information known about the two Missouri Blairs, who had moved to Georgia before 1800.  Thus my current hypothesis is that the Thomas and John Blair who moved to Missouri were the same as the sons of immigrant Thomas Blair of Chester Co., SC.  (A sub-hypothesis--perhaps ďbarely supported speculationĒ would be more accurate--is that they were the Thomas and John Blair of Clarke Co., GA, who entered the Georgia land lottery in 1805, and when they didnít win land in that lottery (both men drew blanks on both of their draws), they moved on to Missouri.)

Iíve ordered some books of abstracts of Chester Co., SC, records on interlibrary loan.  With any luck, these can help us sort out the different Chester Co. Blair families and also help confirm or disprove this hypothesis.

 If this hypothesis turns out to be correct (and bear in mind that ití sonly a guess at this point, though one consistent with the available evidence), it would tie together definitely Debbie (descendant of James), Rick, Bob, and myself (descendants of Thomas (Jr.)), and Shala and perhaps Patricia [Adkins-Rochette] and Sandi [Vaught, desc of Wm. M. Blair's bro of Francis Harvey Blair] (one known and two likely descendants of John).  It would not tie in Harold (though his John William Blair could easily be an as yet unidentified grandson, or possibly great-grandson, of the immigrant Thomas), and it would not tie in Mildred.  Mildredís is the most difficult case, because her earliest known ancestor was born ca. 1801 in Tennessee, and he doesnít seem to have lived anywhere else.  This doesnít fit what is known or hypothesized about the children or migration patterns of any of the four sons of the immigrant Thomas Blair named in his will (James, Thomas, John and William). Only Thomas (Jr.) and John likely came through Tennessee, in their move from Georgia to Missouri, and their sons named Thomas are both accounted for (Thomasís son Thomas Milligan Blair stayed in Missouri, and I believe, though I havenít yet established with certainty, that Johnís son Thomas moved to Lawrence Co., Arkansas).  I havenít yet looked carefully at all the information I have to see if Mildredís ancestor Thomas Blair might fit in somewhere as a descendant of the immigrant Thomas, but right now it appears that Mildred is a yet more distant cousin, descended not from the immigrant Thomas but from one of his relatives.

 Anyway, thatís where I am right now in my research.  As I learn more Iíll keep you all posted.

Richard Carlson

Fri, Sep 19, 2008 09:39 AM         Hello to everyone,    I am Debbie Blair Owen, daughter of Harvey Lenard Blair, who provided the #8466 DNA for the test.

 

First, I would like to give Richard J. Carlson a great BIG thank you for analyzing all this information and coming up with an intelligent hypothesis. Keep in mind that he only has access to the DNA information on this page http://blairdna.com/group04.html not any of the information at http://www.familytreedna.com/ , since he is not a DNA contributing member. This last site does provide everyone's name and email address for each DNA sample, but not the participant number (#8466 in my case) which makes it harder to compare the findings on the two sites. In my case it lists my father's name with my email. I upgraded this summer to the 37-marker test. Just last night, I was notified of another 37-marker match with a genetic distance of 3. I am reluctant to give his name and email address since this is private information. This site is updating faster than the BlairDNA site, which still has not shown my father's 37-marker results.

 

 Second, I would like to clear up any misunderstandings. I was not the person that traced this line back to Thomas Blair (ca. 1729-1796). That person was John Clyde Blair, Sr. (now deceased) who published his findings in 1977 in his book, "The Blair Families Originating in Ireland, South Carolina, Georgia and Alabama".  His brother George Elston Blair (now deceased) updated the book in 1990, and provided the DNA sample which #5502 represents. There is no email for this contact.  I am not sure if there is anyone left in this family that is still interested.

Debbie Blair Owen

Fri, Sep 19, 2008 10:56 AM..........Debbie, thank you for clarifying who did the bulk of the research in tracing your line back to Ireland.  I certainly appreciate the efforts of John Clyde Blair and his brother George, and I didnít mean to slight them.  You mention two different editions of this family history, one from 1977 and one from 1990.  Does the 1990 edition update anything in the earliest section, on the immigrant Thomas and his children, or is it limited to updates and corrections from later generations?

 Mildred, Iím ordering a copy of this book through interlibrary loan.  Iím not sure if itís possible to still buy a copy, since both authors are deceased, but you could probably borrow a copy through a nearby library or Mormon Family History Center.

 For anyone interested in this book, I should say that it concentrates almost exclusively on the descendants of the immigrant Thomas Blair through his son James (born ca. 1758).  Debbie can correct me if Iím wrong, but based on the first few pages (which Debbie kindly provided me copies of), it appears that the book has nothing to say about Thomas Blairís other children after 1795, the date of his will.  Iím hoping to find out more about his other children through the Chester Co., SC, books Iím ordering through interlibrary loan.

 Richard Carlson

Fri, Sep 19, 2008 08:43 PM     Hello all,   I have converted the scanned pages of John Clyde Blair's book into a PDF file and placed them on a website:

http://www.silverhillala.com/blair/

It is just the first chapter (missing the Acknowledgements page which came after the Title page). The 1977 and 1990 books are identical through the first 102 pages. The 1990 edition has a supplement added after page 102 containing updates with no additional information on immigrant  Thomas Blair  and children. Neither of the books are indexed. I will be glad to answer any questions about the book.

I am checking to see if there are still books for sale from the family.

Debbie Owen

Sat, Sep 20, 2008 01:25 PM    ....  Thanks Patti for copying me on your note to Richard.  He mentions his hypothesis that you may be a descendent of John Blair, son of Immigrant Thomas Blair.  Though my line is with Thomas Jr., son of Immigrant Thomas Blair, my grandmother Roberta Bramhall Blair said there is an  "Old" John Blair buried in the same graveyard (Laclede Co. MO) as our ancestor Isaac Blair (son of Thomas Jr.)  

My grandmother was always of the impression that this "Old John Blair" was the father of Isaac Blair & seemed unaware of Thomas Jr. Richard Carlson has convinced me that Thomas Jr. is indeed the father of Isaac, but it still leaves open the question of who this "Old John Blair" might be.

Have you come across any stories of a John Blair in your own research, and do you already have some indication that Richard's hunch about where you fit in may be accurate?

Thanks again Patti, 

Rick Blair, Hiawassee, GA  rbblair@appleorchard.org

.

Mon, Sep 22, 2008 05:59 PM     Hello Everyone,   I just noticed that the Blair Society has the Blair Book to rent on microfilm.  Of course, that means you would have to take it to a library to read it. Here is the link. Look at Roll #3207 - 19.    http://blairsociety.org/microfilm.htm
 
Debbie Owen

Tue, Sep 23, 2008 09:00 AM      Hello Everyone, Below is the letter I received this morning from John A. Blair, the Blair DNA coordinator. It is an answer to the automated contact form I sent him from the Blair DNA web site, which is below his letter.

About three months ago I had written to John, asking if he would consider using the Blair DNA Fund to upgrade George Elston Blair's DNA (#5502) to a 37-marker test. I also informed him that George was deceased. He said he could not upgrade a test without the donor's permission. In my letter three days ago I asked him, once again, if he would consider doing this. His response to this request is his last paragraph - and I think he must have accidentally left off the word "not" after his word "can".

The Group 4 page is now updated:   http://blairdna.com/group04.html

Debbie Blair Owen        

                   re:  Blair DNA Project Adm:   BlairDNA@blairgenealogy.com

Hi Debbie:

I'm afraid I've been a bit neglectful of the website lately. You email was just the "kick in the butt" I needed to try any get it updated. I've now updated the "Results" page and the "Group 02, 04, and 06 thru 09" pages. I've still got to work on Groups 01, 03, and 05. Hopefully I'll get them done this week. It going to get real busy soon. The sale that FTDNA has going on has brought in ten new participants with results pending.

Your father's close matches with 5 members of group 02 on the 12 marker test points out the problem with the 12 marker test. It is not uncommon for 12 marker matches to fall apart at the 25 marker level. When you look at the 25 marker test results you can conclude that any common ancestor probably existed so far back that you could never make a connection.

At the 25 marker level your father is an exact match with 3 other participants (#3950, #5502, and #94491). He is also an exact match match with the hypothetical "common ancestor". You father is a 24/25 match with #78306 and #93820 and a 23/25 match with #4178, #4297, #11100, #55938, and #126134.

At the 37 marker level your father is an exact match with #3950, and #94491 and the hypothetical "common ancestor". He is a 36/37 match with #78306 and #93820 and a 34/37 match with #4178 and #126134.

FTDNA uses "generic distance" to determine matches on it's match page. Generic distance (GD) takes into account not only how many markers you mismatch on but also how big the difference in value is. For the 25 marker test FTDNA considers a GD of 2 a match and a GD of 3 not a match. In the case of #11100 your father mismatches on 2 markers; one marker is off by 1 and the second marker is off by 2, so the GD is 3. This is still a 23/35 marker match with a 50% chance you share a common ancestor with 12 generations and a 90% chance you share a common ancestor with 24 generations.

Unfortunately I can ethically upgrade anyone's test without their permission. Since your father and George share the same oldest known ancestor it is most probable that your 37 marker test results would be the same any way. Even if there was a slight difference it is unlikely this difference would be helpful. Remember, your father's 37 markers results are already identical to the hypothetical "common ancestor".

Good luck on your research.

John A. Blair       j_blair@blairdna.com

Goffstown NH
BLAIR DNA Project Administrator,  
BlairDNA@blairgenealogy.com

 

Fri, Sep 26, 2008 02:45 PM.......Hello Everyone, I have decided to collect information from everyone in our Blair DNA Group 4 and place it on a web site:   http://www.silverhillala.com/blair/

If you have anything to add, please send it to me. This would include web sites, family trees, scanned pages from books, and any other useful information.

If you know of someone that would like to be included in this, please send me their name and email. If you would like your name removed from this mail list, please let me know.

Debbie Blair Owen

 Tue, Sep 30, 2008 07:32 AM....RE: Blair Research Web Site.......Hi Debbie,    Thanks again for creating this web site! Iíve already learned some useful things about the land grant system in South Carolina, and I plan to submit information of my own when I get a chance. For now, let me just include a couple of links to Blair-related web sites.

First is a summary of an 1813 will (proved 1815) of Samuel Blair, apparently of Abbeville Co., SC. This will is of interest not only because Samuel had sons named John and Thomas, but because his will was witnessed by two people named Milligan (Milligan was the middle name of the oldest son of the Thomas Blair who died in 1839 in Cape Girardeau Co., MO):

http://home.earthlink.net/~copeland.deal/abbeville.htm#Blair

I havenít been able to find this Samuel Blair in census records, and havenít yet tried to find him in any other records, so Iím not sure if his children were the right ages to be those that moved to Georgia and then Missouri. To complicate matters, there were other Thomas and John Blairs living in South Carolina and Georgia at this time who seem to have been about the same age as those who moved to Missouri, so we need to be especially careful in sorting out the different families.

The second link is to a transcript of an obituary of William Blair (1820-1899), who was born in Cape Girardeau Co., MO, and died in Jefferson Co., Illinois. He was the son of a Francis Blair who moved from Georgia to the Cape Girardeau area in 1805, and who later moved to Illinois. This was almost certainly Francis Blair, son of John Blair who died in Cape Girardeau Co. in 1808:

http://jefferson.ilgenweb.net/obits/blair-williamjcobit.htm

The third link is to a transcript of a 1909 biographical sketch of William C. Blair, son of William Blair (1820-1899), which gives similar but slightly different information about Francis Blair:

http://jefferson.ilgenweb.net/bios/blair_honwilliam.htm

Iím planning a trip to a regional genealogical library in about 3 weeks, so with any luck, I should be able to find out a bit more to help sort out who was who among these early Blairs. But I already realize that some critical sources, such as Clarke County, GA, deeds, have not yet been abstracted and published. In those cases, Iíll have to order the original record books through my local LDS Family History Center.

-Richard Carlson

Francis Harvey Blair (1832-1883)

Patricia Adkins-Rochette's gg-gfather

prochette@Juno.com

 

F. H. Blair had fifteen CSA

 regimental return cards labeled "2nd Mounted Rifles" from March 1862 until May 1865 in Roark's Company H, Pyron's 2d Cavalry.   Detailed as a saddler and a gunsmith. 

 

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 Patricia Adkins-Rochette        03/20/2013           prochette@Juno.com    

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Bourland in North Texas and Indian Territory During the Civil War: Fort Cobb, Fort Arbuckle & the Wichita Mountains

 Tue, Sep 30, 2008 07:32 AM....RE: Blair Research Web Site     RichadJ.Carlson Blair <richard-j-carlson@uiowa.edu>  "Debbie Owen" <owenpk@gulftel.com>, "Blair, Dru" <dru@drublair.com>, "Blair, Bob" <rcb911@hotmail.com>, "Blair, Harold" <hblair@blair.org>, <jbcbblair@carolina.rr.com>, "Fournier, Mildred" <mwfournier@comcast.net>, "Adkins-Rochette, Patti" <prochette@juno.com>, "Blair, Rick" <rbblair@appleorchard.org>, "Vaught, Sandi" <vaught2@cableone.net>, "Huff, Shala" <shorehuf@sbcglobal.net>, "Blair, William Campbell" <bbblair@comcast.net>